All things related to multicast

[Bill Owens <>]

As we discussed on the NTAC call this afternoon, I’d like to suggest that as a way to minimize the confusion that might be caused by a sudden disappearance of ASM support, we plan for a short-term turn down of the service in advance of the final sunset. Ideally that would happen with some notice, but also as soon as possible, and might last a couple of days before ASM was turned back on. Hopefully people in the community would hear about the test and could make the connection that a particular service stopped working suddenly, then have time to find a workaround before ASM disappears completely.

 

Bill.

 

From: <> on behalf of Chris Wilkinson <>
Date: Wednesday, September 26, 2018 at 4:29 PM
To: David Farmer <>
Cc: "" <>, wg-multicast <>
Subject: Re: [NTAC] I2 Planning to Sunset Interdomain Any Source Multicast

 

David,

 

The Multicast WG () would seem to me to be an excellent place to discuss Multicast related issues, though I would note that recent discussions have largely been cross-posted between the the NTAC and the WG.

 

At this time Internet2 is not planning to provide Multicast Beacons as a service. That said, we’d gladly welcome a community collaboration if there is a clear demand for such things.

 

The operations team has discussed improving SSM monitoring and support but I don’t have anything to report at this time. Again, dialog is welcome.

 

Best,

Chris

 

Chris Wilkinson

Director of Network Architecture and Planning, Internet2

734.352.4962

 

 

From: David Farmer <>
Date: Wednesday, September 26, 2018 at 2:50 PM
To: Chris Wilkinson <>
Cc: "" <>, wg-multicast <>
Subject: Re: [NTAC] I2 Planning to Sunset Interdomain Any Source Multicast

 

Chris,

 

Is the Multicast WG () still the preferred place to discuss Multicast related issues? In not where?

 

I ask because I believe most of the Multicast Beacons were configured for ASM.  Are there suggestions or community BCP for SSM configuration of the Multicast Beacons?  

 

Will Internet2 provide SSM Multicast Beacons?  Anyone else planning to provide SSM Multicast Beacons? How do we coordinate this?

 

Further, if we are going to continue to support SSM Multicasts are there any other suggestions for monitoring it and ensuring that it is actually functioning? 

 

Thanks

 

On Wed, Sep 26, 2018 at 1:40 PM, Chris Wilkinson <> wrote:

Good afternoon NTAC,

Below you will find Internet2's newly minted announcement for the sunset of interdomain ASM currently targeted for 12/15. We're hoping the large lead time will allow us to develop collaborative solutions with anyone who may be impacted by this change. Considering our extensive discussions last year on this topic, it will helpfully not come as a surprise to anyone on this list.

If you have any comments, questions, or concerns please reply on list, to the I2 NTAC channel, or reach out to Mark Brochu and myself. We welcome any and all input.

Best,
Chris

--
Chris Wilkinson
Director of Network Architecture and Planning, Internet2
734.352.4962
--

Internet2, in response to community and Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF) recommendations, as well as interoperability concerns with future growth, will begin the sunset of Interdomain Any Source Multicast (ASM).

As part of this transition, Internet2 will coordinate with members to begin the decommission of Multicast Source Discovery Protocol (MSDP) peerings. This is already occurring with various members and we are seeing an accelerated trend since the release of the Deprecating ASM for Interdomain Multicast Abstract. Internet2 is recommending that the few members that still have active ASM sources transition these to SSM. 

If this is technically impractical, our technical staff can work with your organization and your multicast subscribers to transition to private multicast peerings, such as layer 2 circuits between receivers, and/or the provisioning of private multicast VPNs (mvpns) between participants. Internet2 will be available for feedback and questions during the 2018 Technology Exchange on Oct 15-18. Starting on October 28, Internet2 will begin formally sending notification to any existing MSDP peers that a disconnect will be scheduled. We hope to have all MSDP sessions removed by Dec 15, 2018.

Background:

There are two well-known flavors of IP multicast: Any Source Multicast (ASM), and Source Specific Multicast (SSM). Initially, many applications were written to leverage ASM addressing. This was mostly due to the fact that several operating systems lacked support for IGMPv3, a necessary component of SSM. As such, autonomous networks would exchange information using the Multicast Source Discovery Protocol, or MSDP.

MSDP was implemented in 2003 and has remained in “experimental” status. The low demand across operators for this feature has led to deficiencies which have not been addressed, leading to liabilities on the Internet2 network. These deficiencies include flooding of network state information, lack of state attack protection, and undesired source filtering.

As time progressed, it became clear that the use case for ASM was not as relevant in the interdomain setting. That is, between domains, usually only one source would send data to multiple receivers, something better suited to SSM. Major operating systems have also been supporting SSM for some time (Windows, MacOS, Linux/Android).

As Internet2 continues to evolve its network, it has become clear that our continued support of MSDP would hinder future growth, in part by the lack of attention the protocol has received from vendors, resulting in the deficiencies listed above. In response, the IETF felt it necessary to issue a draft BCP recommending the deprecation of Inter-domain ASM. Internet2 supports the IETF draft and believes this is the best path forward for the community.

Please note that this does NOT mean that Internet2 will stop supporting Interdomain Multicast. PIM SSM and IPv6 will both be supported mechanisms for interdomain multicast applications across the Internet2 footprint.

 

--

===============================================
David Farmer              
Networking & Telecommunication Services
Office of Information Technology
University of Minnesota  
2218 University Ave SE        Phone: 612-626-0815
Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029   Cell: 612-812-9952
===============================================